Rep. French Hill (AR-02) joined me this morning to discuss opposition among House conservatives to a government shutdown:

Audio:

09-26hhs-hill

Transcript:

HH: Another gold bump in honor of Senator Gold Bars Menendez. I am joined by Representative French Hill from Arkansas. Representative Hill is one of the smart guys, because he’s on the Intel Committee. That’s handpicked, and the Republicans are always serious about that. He’s also on Foreign Affairs and Financial Services. Our old friend, John Campbell, used to serve on Financial Services. That’s one of the smart committees. So Representative Hill, welcome back. Good to have you. But you are a Vanderbilt grad, so we’re not going to talk about football. Seriously, you lost to Wake Forest and the University of Las Vegas? Does that, how’s that go down with the Commodore nation?

FH: Well, it’s, we’re always waiting for golf season.

HH: Congressman, the House is going to come up with a solution, or the government’s going to shut down. What’s is going to be?

FH: Look, Hugh, if we want to be strong, if we want to lock in the wins that we got in the debt ceiling negotiation when we put forward a plan that actually cut spending year over year, changed the regulatory focus and encouraged more people back into the workforce, we need to pass these 11 remaining appropriations bills. And that was not gotten to over the summer even though, now think about this, Hugh, even though each of those bills is written at a spending level below the debt ceiling deal, and each one locks in conservative policies. It’s really so frustrating to me that those have been delayed from coming to the House floor, including twice over the last week by a handful of members when they’re missing this big picture. Lock in the wins, cut spending, reduce regulations, get more people back in the workforce, get the spotlight back on Joe Biden’s failures and off of this budget.

HH: Now Congressman Hill, I don’t expect you to speak ill of a colleague, but I can. Congressman Gaetz wants to be governor of Florida. Congressman, Maryland native Matt Rosendale wants to be senator from Montana. Ralph Norman, Congressman Ralph Norman, wants to be senator from South Carolina, going to run against Lindsey Graham. And Congressman Dan Bishop wants to be the attorney general of North Carolina. So I understand self-interest. Those guys have no interest in governing. But do they really want to bring down the Republican majority, because they’re going to get crushed if they do this?

FH: Right. By this kind of tactic, you’re going to end up with a Biden-Schumer clean debt ceiling deal and with spending levels certainly at the Biden-McCarthy level, but weaker policies, weaker policies, because in order to be the strongest negotiator, get the most conservative win, we have to pass the appropriations bills. That’s why McCarthy’s plan this week of trying to get the rest of the bills across the floor, at least 70% of discretionary spending, plus, plus a four-week short-term stopgap spending measure that cuts spending, repeat, cuts spending for that one month, and puts border in the spotlight by putting HR 2 on. There is no conservative that should vote no on that. And this is just arguing against ourselves. It’s a huge mistake.

HH: Now Congressman Hill, I call him now St. Kevin. I’ve known the Speaker for a long time, and now I’m going to have him nominated to be considered for sainthood, because that is a difficult caucus to deal with. When you’ve got four members who are leading the knucklehead caucus, and my buddy Ken Buck wants a CNN contract, there really isn’t appeal to their self-interest. How do you move them? I mean, are you going to have to use Democrat votes? And can Speaker McCarthy remain speaker if he uses Democrat votes?

FH: Well, I think that’s why we have to try every single day to put a bill on the floor and find out, that as you say, this small group, that is the tyranny of the tiny, as I describe it, is violating the majority of the majority, because they’re going to hurt the conservative cause. They’ll cause us to lose the House. And that’s certainly not in the interest of the conservative cause when we’re on the cusp of potentially beating Biden in the presidential election and winning the Senate back. It’s ridiculous.

HH: You know, if Former President Trump gets reelected, and the House switches to Democrat, they will impeach him in the first week. Do these allegedly Trump-supporting Congressmen, and it’s Norman, it’s Maryland-native Matt Rosendale who’s running for Senate in Montana, it’s Ralph Norman, and it’s Matt Gaetz. Have they heard from the Former President that he wants to be impeached again, because they sure are acting like they want him impeached again.

FH: Well, look, they don’t even, they spin what he says now. President Trump last week said use the power of the purse to get control of Joe Biden’s $2 trillion dollars of extra spending. I agree. That’s what the debt ceiling does, and that’s what these spending bills do. And that’s why we have to get them across the House floor. He did not say, he, Trump, did not say shut the government down and act like knuckleheads. He said use the power of the purse to get the most conservative deal, get this country back on track. I agree. That’s what we could do if we had those four people assist us get these bills across the floor this week.

HH: Well, I just, their incentives are to get ink. And I mean, their incentives are not the incentives to govern. And I don’t know how hot it gets in the caucus. Can you tell us that? Are members of the caucus about had it with these guys?

FH: Yeah.

HH: There’s nothing you can do, because they’re running for statewide office. But have they had it and expressed it?

FH: Well, I think they have had it and expressed it in blunt terms, including calling them out that if you vote against the rule on the House floor, you’re working with the minority party. You’re working with Democrats when you do that. That is not acting as a member of the majority. And I think you’re seeing the country respond, too. Look at Moody’s comments yesterday. Look at the Vix up to date – 3%. Look at the 10-year Treasury rate up over 4.5%. This is going in the wrong direction when we should be taking a win right now of cutting spending ’24 over ’23, getting better rules and regulations in place, countering Joe Biden’s bad policies, and as I say, encouraging more people back to work through our welfare reforms. These are classic conservative Republican wins, and we’re squandering the opportunity.

HH: Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory is kind of a Republican specialty in the House, so let’s focus on that for a moment. When do you get a test vote – today or tomorrow on whether or not the four will move or they will stay for? They’ve got more than four right now, but you’ve got serious people like Chip Roy who are not playing these games. Will the Freedom Caucus bring whatever persuasive influence they have to bear on them?

FH: Oh, we’re going to bring a rule. We, the Rules Committee met Friday and all day Saturday, so we’ll be bringing a rule up either tonight or early in the morning. That will be the first test case to see if we can move these spending bills, which include state and foreign operations spending, which is at $1.7 billion below 2019 levels. The Ag bill, which good conservative wins in it, Homeland Security, to stick it to Joe Biden, we, on his failed border policy where you’ve got fentanyl pouring in, six million people have crossed the border under his watch, 151 on the terror watch list. So Homeland Security, and finally, the Defense bill, which is something traditionally does not have problems passing inside the Republican conference.

HH: You know, Congressman, last Friday, I talked to Mike Lawler, your colleague from New York. And he’s one of the moderates. You know, he’s to my left.

FH: Yes.

HH: He’s to your left. He wants to use the discharge petition if necessary. That is a win for Hakeem Jeffries and Joe Biden, but it’s better than shutting the government down. Do you think it’s going to end up being the discharge petition?

FH: Well, look, if we don’t get support from the Republican conference, then you will know that these four or five Republican, I won’t even say conservatives…

HH: They’re not.

FH: These Republican self-interested populists or people running for another office, social media gurus, whatever they are, they will have turned the floor over to Democrats and over to Chuck Schumer. It doesn’t make any difference if it’s by the form of the discharge petition or taking up a Senate continuing resolution motion. The bottom line is the only reason that will happen is because of these four people who are going against taking conservative Republican wins on the budget. It makes no sense. It’s totally, as you say, geared to their own self-interest. And they’re not complying with something that I think about every day in the Preamble of the Constitution, which is the General Welfare clause. They’re busting that and their oath to get this done in the right way.

HH: You know, I got an email from my son, who’s on active duty. He said do we get paid if the government shuts down? And I said sorry, you don’t. And I really do not understand how the Republican Party has become anti-military. The Tuberville holds in the Senate, I understand what his point is, but he’s made it, and it’s been gotten. And now shutting down Defense spending and cutting off the troops from their pay, do these four understand? They’re not going to win statewide. They all have military bases in South Carolina and in Florida. Maryland-born Matt Rosendale may not know that Montana has a considerable military vote. But North Carolina’s Dan Bishop has got it. The military doesn’t forget this stuff, Congressman.

FH: No, look. The communities that support our men and women in uniform in North Carolina, in Montana, and Florida, my gosh, the Panhandle of Florida, hello? These folks need to hear, the congressmen need to hear from their community-based advisory boards, the chamber of commerce, the military families association to let them know this is really ridiculous. We’ve just moved the NDAA to conference. That was a good vote on the House floor. We got it off the House floor. That’s good. And we need to pass the Defense appropriations bill. We’re all claiming that we’re concerned about great power competition with Iran, Russia, and China, giving our guys and gals in uniform a 5.2% pay increase, and yet we have this deleterious nonsense on the House floor by a handful.

HH: Now let me close by talking about Speaker McCarthy. I think he’s got a unique skill set for this conference, because he’s got the moderates, Mike Lawler and the guys over on the left side of the Republican caucus, and then you’ve got the wrecking ball crew in the knucklehead caucus over on, they’re not the right-wingers. They’re just self-interested statewide candidates who are going to lose, if I have anything to say about it, if they do this. What levers does the Speaker have on both ends of the caucus?

FH: Well, it’s very similar, and it’s so reminiscent of his 15-round victory to become Speaker in January, and his leadership, the only leader in Washington to get a debt ceiling deal across the Congress. It’s because he’s got good self-confidence. He’s a good leader. He’s a good communicator. And look, 95% of Republicans in the House and a bunch of Democrats appreciate his leadership. And so that leadership, if he stays true to it, he’ll see us through this. But look, McCarthy’s done a good job countering Biden and the fact that we have a Democratically-controlled Senate. This is never the easiest role for a Speaker, and he’s done a good job.

HH: Well, if we can just get to November next year, I believe your majority will increase if they don’t shut down the government. But I have been around doing this since 1990. Every government shutdown, no matter when it occurs, is blamed effectively on Republicans. I have learned that lesson. There is no denying that. Has that been your experience, Congressman Hill?

FH: It has been my experience, and you’re putting a guy like Mike Lawler, you just talked about him, Westchester County, suburban New York, in trouble. He’s in a Biden +13 district, but he’s an excellent representative who knows every aspect of his district. He’s doing a fine job representing them. They voted for him. He wants to be reelected. But this is the kind of tough situation that you’re putting one of those swing seats in California and New York into trouble. And we just can’t have that. We’ve got to win those seats and then take three or four more seats back and have a bigger majority going into 2025.

HH: Congressman French Hill, thank you for joining me, member of the Intel Committee, member of Financial Services and Foreign Affairs, and a strong supporter of Speaker McCarthy, and serious conservatives are. You’re getting a rump on the right. It’s just a rump on the right. Pay no attention to the statewide candidates, and do not give them money.

End of interview.